Assignment 20: "Forbidden"

Posted: Sun Sep 17, 2006 6:48 pm

Here's a link to the original:
http://www.pbase.com/stfchallenge/image/27360941

I'm not sure what the real name of the original photographer is, but appears to use the alias LENWOODBLUZ.

I actually find the title / subject a bit repugnant (oh god, not another forbidden fruit / sin / temptation allusion) but I was looking for something low key (I tend to overdo normal exposure; I don't think about altenatives enough), that I was sure was not just the result of extensive digital editing, and that I could reproduce without paying a model and going out to the camera store to buy a studio.

Posted: Sun Sep 17, 2006 7:09 pm

OK.

Now to analyze the image.

This appears to be shot indoors with artificial lighting. I think that there is little argument there.

You need to answer the following:

1. How many lights were used?

2. Placement of the lights

3. How was the red color introduced to the shot?

4. What is the surface that the apple is resting on?

5. Is there anything special going on with the processing?

6. Is there any fill lighting?

7. What fruit or vegetable are you planning on using?

8. Are you going to have a hand reaching for it as shown? Or is there some other message you want?

This is an interesting project. I doubt you will get it exactly right with one attempt. Your intermediate attempts may be superior to this shot, but do not settle on them. The point of this assignment is learning to control your medium with the skill required to replicate this effect.

It would not surprise me at all if you come up with your own lighting effect that you like better as a result. That is one of the really nice things about emulating an existing image.

REMEMBER: A technique is of little use unless you can call it up and use it at will. If it turns out well by luck and you are not able to replicate it reliably, then it is not a technique at all. It is just serendipity.

Write down and sketch out all your setups so that you can replicate them at any time in the future. Maintain a scrapbook with the image and the recipe. If you enlarge that scrapbook over the years you will have an effective tool than enables you to bring to bear a large number of effects at any time you require them.

Go ahead and answer my questions and post your own. Also make note of the shooting angles, and your estimate of the focal length of the lens.

In my opinion there is too much light spilling onto the hand and it steals attention from the rimmed apple. I think this is a single shot and not a blending of 2 shots, and you should approach it as a single image.

Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2006 11:15 am

Alright, first of all the lighting looks pretty simple now that I'm thinking about it a bit more carefully. I hope it turns out to be a lot more challenging than I'm thinking it is right now. It probably will.

packard wrote:

1. How many lights were used?
2. Placement of the lights

One, directly behind the apple and under the hand. Looks like an off camera flash laying down on the surface (appears to give a rectangular reflection below the apple).

Quote:

3. How was the red color introduced to the shot?
4. What is the surface that the apple is resting on?

I'm thinking that it was bounced off the apple and maybe the floor (which looks like dark hardwood floor).

Quote:

5. Is there anything special going on with the processing?

Now that I think about it, I suspect the image of the light source has been masked out. It's possible that a lot of the image was masked and the dark areas painted black but I'm not going to allow myself the luxury of that treatment in my reproduction.

Quote:

6. Is there any fill lighting?

I don't think so, but it's possible that some kind of reflector was used to get a bit more light onto the hand. My other thought is that a longer focal length was used (to reduce perspective) and the hand is actually slightly behind the apple relative to the camera (to illuminate it from the bottom a bit more).

Quote:

7. What fruit or vegetable are you planning on using?

Hmmm, I hadn't considered using something else. How about a celebration of sin; grapes are a sinful fruit, aren't they? Maybe I'll buy a cluster of grapes and try it that way. In the spirit of the assignment I'll probably try to reproduce this shot with an apple first, then see if I can do anything more interesting with grapes.

Quote:

8. Are you going to have a hand reaching for it as shown? Or is there some other message you want?

Nope, I'm going to have some greedy little hand (most likely my own) reaching for the fruits. You bring up a good point though; what's the message or point of this kind of shot? I need to think about that a bit.

Quote:

approach it as a single image.

I am going to try to complete this with only very basic editing - no masking, selective dodging/burning, etc. I'll give myself curves & levels & uniform colour adjustments & sharpening type processing, but nothing else. I may have to find a unique way to get the light focused down so that you can't see the light poking out around the apple.

I probably won't have time to start working on this until wednesday night.

Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2006 1:55 pm

I think you have this pretty much right as far as the analysis goes.

I would shoot this on a wood table as it will be easier to set up.

I suspect that the lighting is a good bit simpler than you imagine. I think he (she) used a small light that is hidden behind the fruit. A "Mini-Maglite" with the lens removed (bare bulb) would probably work fine. I would try it with the lens in place first as it gives greater control. If you need to remove the lens, then use black construction paper as a gobo (or a mini-snoot).

Alternatively, if you shoot on a table, you can have the flash head below and behind the table and aiming towards the apple.

Personally I think it is a very tiny light that is completely hidden behind the apple. If you replicate this shot, also try adding a "gobo" made from toothpicks and black construction paper to reduce the amount of light hitting the hand. Push the toothpicks into the fruit and tape the black paper to the picks. If you do this right it will remain hidden behind the fruit.

I think this is a good subject. There is some interesting problem solving here and the potential to make an interesting image.

The grapes sounds good for the second try. I think it is too translucent and the back lighting will make the fruit glow. An interesting effect that is worth pursuing, but is not this shot. Try an apple or a red pepper or a green pepper, or a strawberry--something opaque.

Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 12:36 am

packard wrote:

I suspect that the lighting is a good bit simpler than you imagine. I think he (she) used a small light that is hidden behind the fruit. A "Mini-Maglite" with the lens removed (bare bulb) would probably work fine.

I am not totally convinced of this, first because of the apparently rectangular reflection in the wood, and second because the hand isn't at all motion blurred which you might expect from a very weak penlight type light source (and longer exposure). Hm.

Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 10:00 am

The shooter left instructions:

thanks for all your comments. much appreciated. This shot I used my surefire flashlight directly behind the apple... It was about 3 feet behind it. I positioned the apple so you lose sight of the flashlight. Originaly I was gonna just have the apple but when i went to move the apple to the right a bit, I caught a glimpse of my hand in the lcd. I knew exactly what i had to do. Then, after that the shot kinda "took itself"...I'm pretty happy with it. It really helped that i had the surefire flashlight.... the power of the flashlight made the shot...thanks again

I was not far off:

SureFire Flashlight

I think you could use a cardboard tube and some aluminum foil to make a very directional snoot--it would have to be quite long--and you could use your flash.

Alternatively, if you got a piece of 1/2" diameter acrylic rod and heated it to bend it at right angles, you could use that as an ersatz fiber optic and direct the light that way.

I think that there are several work arounds for this. Figure what is easiest for you and give it a try.

This analysis part is really quite a bit of fun--especially with a unique set up like this.

Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 2:04 pm

Heh, I intentionally avoided looking for that. I actually passed up another photo that I liked better because I accidentally read a description of the setup :) That acrylic tube idea is a really cool one - have you any experience doing this?

packard wrote:

The shooter left instructions:

thanks for all your comments. much appreciated. This shot I used my surefire flashlight directly behind the apple... It was about 3 feet behind it. I positioned the apple so you lose sight of the flashlight. Originaly I was gonna just have the apple but when i went to move the apple to the right a bit, I caught a glimpse of my hand in the lcd. I knew exactly what i had to do. Then, after that the shot kinda "took itself"...I'm pretty happy with it. It really helped that i had the surefire flashlight.... the power of the flashlight made the shot...thanks again

I was not far off:

SureFire Flashlight

I think you could use a cardboard tube and some aluminum foil to make a very directional snoot--it would have to be quite long--and you could use your flash.

Alternatively, if you got a piece of 1/2" diameter acrylic rod and heated it to bend it at right angles, you could use that as an ersatz fiber optic and direct the light that way.

I think that there are several work arounds for this. Figure what is easiest for you and give it a try.

This analysis part is really quite a bit of fun--especially with a unique set up like this.

Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 3:09 pm

A gooseneck fiber optic bundle would be ideal, but too expensive. They start at about $200.00. Fiber Optics.

My experience is just these:

1. I bought a Pelican version of the Mini-Maglight and it came with an adapter that was made from 3/8" acrylic rod and it was used to direct the light into bores.

2. I was at a trade show and they had many rods all illuminated from one bulb.

I think (and I am not sure) that is run of the mill acrylic rod with both ends polished smooth, and bent by heating to the correct shape. This is rod and not tubing.

If you can find a cheap bundle of fiber optic cable, that would be ideal because you can flex it where ever you want. Other than that, the acrylic rod might work. The larger diameter will pass a larger diameter of light. If you want to contain the light in the rod, you will need to cover the outside (shrink wrap tubing will work).

That's all I know on the subject. Perhaps you can find more on the internet.

Also, I did not look at that link until after you said that the flash light would not be powerful enough. I think that the flash light in question is one of those LED flash lights. At $275.00 it better be well made and bright.

Posted: Wed Sep 20, 2006 11:59 pm

Wow, this assignment is fantastic. It's much (much) harder than I thought, and I have much more respect for the image I'm trying to copy. So far my results have been a lot worse than I expected, and I've been at it for about an hour and a half. (Got a nice little snoot built though).

I won't give up, but I may have to give it a rest for today and rethink my approach (not just to this problem but to how I'm trying to solve this problem).

Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 2:53 am

erased.

Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 2:57 am

The assignment is not complete, I'm just posting intermediate stages up to the point where I got tired tonight.

Here's my first attempt (just a straight shot with the flash behind the apple, sitting on my dusty end table, basically corresponding to my first guess about what was done here):

No good obviously.

After a whole bunch of experimentation including such intermediates as:

Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 2:58 am

I ended up with this as my best effort tonight:

Unfortunately what seems to happen here is that the unseen back side of the apple, and the shiny surface of the table, reflects light onto the hand which then provides a bit of reflected illumination for the edges of the apple (very weakly though). Without the red construction paper the hand is basically white, though the apple provides some red colour to the hand.

My big challenge here is to figure out how to backlight the rim of the apple crisply and directly with the lighting setup instead of having to use light bounced off my hand, or indirectly with some reflectors other than my hand. I didn't really get a single shot where straight backlighting could accomplish this. I had an intermediate snoot design that was about the same diameter as the apple, but I couldn't find a placement for it that would work.

Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 2:59 am

The setup was kind of ridiculous.

Overview:

From left to right: reflector (does not make a big difference here), tripod + camera (used to take this shot obviously), dusty wooden end table, apple, red paper reflector, black gobo covering a clear pen tube (like bic but round), black background to block light leaks from lame snoot, highly tapered snoot with pen-tube sized end (black construction paper with aluminum foil interior).

More detail:

The pen can be seen, which acts similar to the acrylic rod you suggested (bleeds a lot of light out the sides though). The folded black paper triangle to the left is a gobo that I had sitting over the tube to stop it from overly illuminating my hand.

Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 3:01 am

Snoot end detail, sans pen:

Snoot interior:

This needs work, but this is the intermediate setup I got to to get my best shot tonight (which still is a far cry from what I'm going for). I'll clean the table before my next session with this. Man I feel lame.

I do realize now the need for a better control over my flash firing. I had to shoot at 4 seconds and trigger the flash manually with one hand while holding the other hand over the apple. This is obviously not the best way, but my off camera cord is too short. Probably need to buy canon's stupid ridiculously expensive off camera flash wireless transmitter.

Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 10:18 am

It may very well be that the original was a "happy accident" and might not be repeatable by the photographer.

I would try my idea with the mini-maglight if you have access to one.

When you finally get this right, just think of all that you have learned about light control and photo problem solving.

Obviously this is doable. Getting from here (not quite good) to there (really good) could easily take several more attempts.

I would try to find a better shooting surface. You have many options. The nicest is a sheet of black acrylic--but make sure it is clean and free of scratches.

Other choices include: prefinished flooring (clamp it together) or Pergo flooring (3 or 4 pieces are all you need).

Wait until you iron out your lighting.

I really think that the guy just lucked out. He aimed his flashlight with an adjustable focus on the back of the apple and the spill happened to be right for the shot.

What you are doing (copying) is much harder.